Fender "String Rattle"... Why.??

Treva · Post by **Treva** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:59 pm

Excuse my Ignorance Chaps, but can anyone give me any "Info" on Why!
Fender "Strat" guitars, "Rattle very Tinny", on the: *G & B* strings.??
especially when played "Softly" (Lead) and when played "Hard" Rythm..
I have other guitars that *DO NOT*..So, why just Fenders.????
Any "Positive" Info, greatly appreciated...

Rog · Post by **Rog** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 1:04 pm

Hi Trev, I can only think its in the guitar setup. My Strat doesn't do it.

One rattle I did get though was when I backed the truss rod right off and it rattled when I hit the side of the neck.

Does it rattle on certain frets, or just open strings?

Post by Bg » Tue Apr 27, 2004 2:36 pm

yep what he says... if its open string its likely that it needs a new nut. if not you will need to adjust the truss rod, might even need the neck shimming.

Treva · Post by **Treva** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 3:48 pm

Many thanks Guys... It rattles on "Open And Played"
strings, from "G" Fret (3rd.) to "E" up top... A Guy told me that you cant get rid of it..But, does not make sense...??? Will try a New nut, and see what happens... Question: What if I tried a Slightly Larger string in those Two applications.???
Many thanks...

)

Post by Bg » Tue Apr 27, 2004 3:50 pm

is it more of a rattle or a buzz? - can you make out if its rattling against the first fret?

TMG 03 · Post by **TMG 03** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 4:01 pm

Sounds like the nut was cut for a larger string set.

Rog · Post by **Rog** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:26 am

If you are going to put in a new nut anyway - use an old trick we bassists use for loose strings:

Drop a bit of superglue mixed with baking powder into the too-large slot. Make sure the sides are taped to stop overflow. File flat across the top. File it carefully to suit your string.

On bass, this works perfectly, but I admit to never having tried in on guitar. But it you're gonna chuck a new nut on - what can it hurt?

Also, if you are using '9s, try a set of '10s or '11s to see if there's a difference - this may help to isolate the problem.

offender · Post by **offender** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 10:06 am

Treva wrote:Many thanks Guys... It rattles on "Open And Played"
strings, from "G" Fret (3rd.) to "E" up top... A Guy told me that you cant get rid of it..But, does not make sense...??? Will try a New nut, and see what happens... Question: What if I tried a Slightly Larger string in those Two applications.???
Many thanks... )

When was the last time it went in for a setup??
What guage strings are you playing at the moment??

I think that taking it to a good guitar tech would definitely solve your problems - like the others say though the nut may need some work.

Treva · Post by **Treva** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 3:06 pm

Thanks once again Guys.. I am using 10's, and will not go to a Larger Size, as they are a A......le..to use..I have had it to Luthier and had it all set up, intonation/ new Med Jumbo s.s. Frets, etc..Cost me
over $300... He says you can't do anything about it, but I dissagree..Other Guitars have not got it, so why do Fenders have it..he calls it : "Strat - Rattle".. I will try a new Nut and see what happens.
Will Post a "Comment" when done.. Thanks to you all for your Input....

)

offender · Post by **offender** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 5:36 pm

So you had a strat - took it to a Luthier, who put new Jumbo frets on but says that nothing can be done about the rattle.

So I presume that the rattle existed before he put the new frets in and exists afterwards as well??? Did he do anything with the nut???

I have heard quite a few strats - from cheapiers to gen-u-whine USA strats and I haven't heard any 'rattling' on the B and high E strings.

I suggest you go to a different guitar tech.

Also you may want to try posting to the Fender Forum.

VillageIdiot · Post by **VillageIdiot** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 6:46 pm

Please don't put inverted commas around every third word!

Your Trademe auctions make me wanna scream every time I read them!!!!

B45-12 · Post by **B45-12** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 1:27 am

I agree with DrRog - the Luthier is pulling your parts as I too have had strats for some 30 odd years and no rattle - nor have umpteen of my mates/acquaintances - even my brother-in-law's chinese strat has no such rattle.

Since knowledge is power, the first thing to do is try to isolate the rattle and why. You say all the way up the neck on B and E strings - so I suggest;

1) hold the strings AFTER the nut and BEFORE the tuners at the top and check it's not them rattling - if it is the old standby of a bit of foam rubber is the simplest cure.

2) Check the strings are coming off the nut ABOVE the fingerboard - should be slight gap below the string where it leaves the nut and zooms towards the pickups at the other end. If no gap you definately need a new nut.

3) If there is a gap, check the neck is reasonably straight - easiest way is with a long metal straight edge (metal mechanics rule is ideal) laid between 1st and 12th fret - should be a very small gap (about thickness of a carboard business card at the 5th and 6th fret). If on the other hand the straight edge rocks up and down on those frets, and there is a space at the 12th and 1st fret the truss rod is too tight and needs adjusting/slackening off.

4) OK the rattle is there but it's not 1, 2 or 3, then check the bridge saddle is a decent height above the plate - easiest way is to wind it up a bit and see if cures the problem (you will need small allen keys to start with) but you could also measure from the guitar surface to the top of the fingerboard and add on say 5mm - if it's lower than that, it need setting.

5) Last possibility I can think of, if the above do not show up the problem, is the neck joint may have been shimmed up too much or come loose (it's only held on by screws) - easiest to get a tech to look for this.

Now if anyone has any other ideas, they might like to jump in but basically I reckon after you've done the above and found/not found take it to another luthier (not the Fender rattle guy) and explain to him/her what you've done and what the problem is or seems to be. That way they know you have some idea and, hopefully, will treat you seriously.

One more rare condition that can happen, though, is the neck wood can get soft under the nut (biological decay or just weak wood) and the nut actually sink into the wood under the pressure of the strings - I've had this happen on a classical (only one out of 40 plus guitars I've owned so it's relatively rare) and the answer is a new nut. That should be picked up under 2 above (no space under strings)

Good luck and one book I'd suggest for setups/necks info is the Dan Erlwhine one - title escapes me (and my extract is buried deeply in the other room) but you can probably find a mention of it on the net with a google or similar search.

Rog · Post by **Rog** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 6:54 am

Wow!
Great post, Mate!!

Polar Bear · Post by **Polar Bear** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:31 am

And good news, nuts are dirt cheap (especially at neverland), so that's always a good thing!

Post by Bg » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:55 am

last resort - possibly the trem springs rattling. Again a bit of foam could help!