FREE SOUNDMAN - Wellington City

rickenbackerkid · Post by **rickenbackerkid** » Sun Apr 15, 2012 7:38 pm

Hi Guys,

I've never really "past participle of get" into the live sound scene in Wellington, I've been busy doing sound in church.
(not 2 microphones and an organ, 20+ channels of audio, 6+ monitor mixes)

I was thinking that I'd be keen to do sound for a couple of local bands, just to get out there, have a change from church gigs and meet some people.

So Wellington bands, PM if you'd be interested in having me come and do some sound for you, for free!

You'd been blown away at how much better your gig can be with a tech nerd who knows your band, can trouble shoot and has a decent set of ears.

In terms of experience, 10+ years mixing with a couple of gigs a month, Certificate of Live Sound and Recording from Excel School of Performing Arts and a major part of my day job is designing, building and operating various production systems.
I also do the occasional freelance recording project, mainly through Vertical Studios.

Who knows, it might develop and turn into a useful collaboration?

capt abaham · Post by **capt abaham** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:06 am

can i just say this: i`m not cool with people doing this for free when there are people who rely on the money to pay the bills

TmcB · Post by **TmcB** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:18 am

How else is he meant to get experience and a good rep?

RuBear · Post by **RuBear** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:45 am

capt abaham wrote:can i just say this: i`m not cool with people doing this for free when there are people who rely on the money to pay the bills

I never understand this, if the sound guys can't offer something that can't be had for free, then they don't deserve the money. Am I allowed to help my mum move her furniture when there are people who rely on the money to pay the bills? Anyway likely any band who takes this offer probably wouldn't normally be able to afford a sound guy.

Post by **Capt. Black** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:50 am

Do you advertise yourself as available to help anyones mum move for free?

crowbgood1 · Post by **crowbgood1** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:56 am

All depends how much the band is making on the gig. I doubt a band who manages to scrape 200 to 500 from their share of the door having a free sound guy is putting any of the pros' out of work.

capt abaham · Post by **capt abaham** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:02 pm

RuBear wrote:I never understand this, if the sound guys can't offer something that can't be had for free, then they don't deserve the money.

Think of it this way. The RWC made squillions of profit for a select few while hundreds of fools worked for free as volunteers. It’s the industry where only designers and P.R people get paid and we all work for free to get experience. Please mate it BS, no one should work for free, not ever.

Ben offereng to work for free has put one guy out of pocket, simple as that.

i bet some of the guys on this thread over charge for what they do but when it comes to music/gigs etc its ohhh can you do it for free mate, we are only getting the door. while i drive home in my SS Conformadore

Post by **Capt. Black** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:04 pm

TmcB wrote:How else is he meant to get experience and a good rep?

I think Bens cv and qualifications as stated, already puts him ahead of the pack.
Personally, I'm somewhere in the middle on the subject but err towards capt. Abs pov.
I'd rather see someone put themselves out there as being available at reasonable rates and then having the flexibility to adjust on a case by case basis.

It's also very hard to shake a rep as good and free once you start wanting to charge, without creating a lot of resentment among the people you've worked with.
Whereas being known as good and cutting the occasional deal to help the needy can strengthen people's appreciation tremendously.

In my own bands experience, there are no more than 5 people I'd let mix us. I've never paid less than the going rate for them. And even if there's a free guy available I'd still pay one of the ones I know and trust.
So sometimes... Actually quite often, free can be a turn off.

Not getting at Ben in any way. I hope he does well. But I'd encourage him to think again about how he pitches himself.

RuBear · Post by **RuBear** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:11 pm

Capt. Black wrote:Do you advertise yourself as available to help anyones mum move for free?

I essentially advertised myself out at uni to anyone in my class friends or not who wanted help with anything, meanwhile there are tutors who charged $40 an hour to the same students for help, and the tutors are mostly other students who probably needed the cash. If I had known I was being such an asshole though I would never have helped anyone.

EDIT: Also the why of this was that I felt it helped me get a concrete understanding/ helped remember everything, so similar reasons to Ben wanting experience.

crowbgood1 wrote:All depends how much the band is making on the gig. I doubt a band who manages to scrape 200 to 500 from their share of the door having a free sound guy is putting any of the pros' out of work.

What if it was for a bigger gig though? If he has the skills to do the job and is willing in order to build his reputation and relationships within the industry in order to create a money making opportunity later why shouldn't he be able to?

capt abaham wrote:Ben offereng to work for free has put one guy out of pocket, simple as that.

I really have no problem with this, it's put one guy out of pocket, but that money has gone back to the band/venue who didn't have to pay for the soundguy, it hasn't been burnt. Meanwhile Ben has been payed in terms of experience which he obviously thinks is worthwhile or equivalent in value for him. Other people being overpaid is a completely separate issue which I might be more inclined to agree with you on.

Scooter13 · Post by **Scooter13** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:11 pm

I know bands that if they do make a good taking on the door would pay a free sound guys some moneys anyway, if he's done a good job. I had a gig a few weeks ago and I think our share of the door was $50 or something pathetic. But the sound guy was a fantastic guy (had worked with Linkin Park or something) so we still gave him a large share of that money anyway. There's definately a lot of cowboys areound though too, who are happy to take an unfair cut for a poor job.
Props to OP for offering his services free of charge. I'm sure the connections he makes will result in more work down the track. There's nothing wrong with advertising in this manner IMHO, unless it's annoying and in your face, a la door knockers.

RuBear · Post by **RuBear** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:20 pm

Capt. Black: That makes way more sense to me, it may not be the best option for Ben in terms of promoting himself, you guys would know more than me though about that. I just think that you shouldn't hold back from doing that because your going to hurt someone who gets paid for it, if you think it will benefit you.

Post by **Capt. Black** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:36 pm

I actually think it sounds more like Ben is looking for a band he gets on with to form a long term collaboration. Kind of like a fifth member.

capt abaham · Post by **capt abaham** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:41 pm

its not easy getting started but after 10 years Ben should have a few contacts ay

hamo · Post by **hamo** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:57 pm

This discussion is jogging my memory a hit. I'm sure I read somewhere that you should never work for free go gain experience or try to land a customer, for the.reasons capt b has stated mainly. Might have been in relation to design or writing, can't remember, but the principle was the same.

robnobcorncob · Post by **robnobcorncob** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:02 pm

Good on you Ben. Whilst you have listed your services are 'free' don't let anyone walk all over you (not least the people on this forum).

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