New bassist, want advice!

[sonicfantom]

It's a funny story, but after playing with a bunch of friends who wanted to "step up a notch", I suddenly got picked as the bassist.

Fact 1: There are three guitarists, and a keyboard.
Fact 2: One is formerly a drummer, and will be returning to the drums.
Fact 3: One is a relatively new acoustic guitarist, and will either be playing an Acou/Elec or an Elec guitar.
Fact 4: Myself, a person who plays whatever songs in whatever styles, got picked as bass. Why?

The fingerstyle plucking probably caught the drummer's attention. Or the inverted 5th power chords. How should I know?

Anyway, I have my heart (and meager wallet) set on a Squier Standard Jazz Bass - like my current guitar, I will end up modifying this one as well (considering a pair of Fender USA Jazz Bass pickups - not too familiar with Bass pickups, some help here?) I was considering some other basses, but this one just... feels... right. It's the beautiful neck feel and the string spacing, though the action is stupidly out.

Cutting to the quick: If i can get the Jazz Bass for $700, how much do I need to spend on an amp? I'll be playing in the band above, and I need to be heard over the drummer - we play mostly slower contemporary christian music, in a smallish room about 6x12m. I could either buy a combo bass amp, or rout my output through the room's PA (some big, big speakers in there, pretty big cones), in which case I'll need a practice amp as well.

I'd rather skimp on an amp than skimp on the bass - I get attached to things I touch a lot, whereas amps are just amps to me - so that $700 tag is staying.

ANY advice would be awesome!

[Bg]

hmmmm.... why buy new for a start? I've owned a mexican jazz and a mexican precision both a cut above the squiers I've tried and at a 2nd hand price of $600 each. And I didn't have to modify either of them... just a thought If you really want new, thats cool but don't modify to the point of negative equity.

Oh and FFS, don't play the bass like a guitar, play it like a bass you can always tell the real bass players from the frustrated guitarists

[TmcB]

Anyway, I have my heart (and meager wallet) set on a Squier Standard Jazz Bass - like my current guitar, I will end up modifying this one as well (considering a pair of Fender USA Jazz Bass pickups - not too familiar with Bass pickups, some help here?) I was considering some other basses, but this one just... feels... right. It's the beautiful neck feel and the string spacing, though the action is stupidly out.

Cutting to the quick: If i can get the Jazz Bass for $700, how much do I need to spend on an amp? I'll be playing in the band above, and I need to be heard over the drummer - we play mostly slower contemporary christian music, in a smallish room about 6x12m. I could either buy a combo bass amp, or rout my output through the room's PA (some big, big speakers in there, pretty big cones), in which case I'll need a practice amp as well.

I'd rather skimp on an amp than skimp on the bass - I get attached to things I touch a lot, whereas amps are just amps to me - so that $700 tag is staying.

ANY advice would be awesome!

As BG implied, don't spend $700 on a new squire, spend that on a used Mexican Fender Jazz which is generally a cut above but there's a fella on here with some serious gear that loves his squire. Depends if you're after bang for buck; I'd certainly go the used MIM route. Better resale too.

As for bass pups, check out Seymour Duncan Quarter Pounders for bigger rock tone. Depends how much you care to spend, you can go all the way up to big bucks with Lindy Fralin or Nordstrand pups. I have a pair of John Suhr designed pick ups out of a MIA Jazz Deluxe that may be of some use to you. From fender I think it's the 62 noiseless pups that have a reasonable rep. Modifying stuff never makes it worth more, but you feel it should.

In your situation I'd get a pedal like the Tech 21 VT Bass and chuck it through the PA. Gives you a good ampeg svt sound for not too much. Either get one from the US or get the Rockshop to price challenge. Depending on the PA, I'd just chuck it through there. Contemporary Christian music doesn't tend to get too raucous so you'll be fine especially in a room that size. Maybe make sure you have a speaker very close to you and get the bass to pan out through that one if it's a stereo system. I'd skimp on the amp and put funds towards a bass too.

And +1 to not playing it like a frustrated guitarist

[Hot_Grits]

+1 on used MIM bass. If buying new is an absolute priority then I suggest you look at the new Squier classic vibe basses. Those are a very high quality piece for the money, well set up with good woods.

The idea of a sansamp VT bass pedal into the PA is a good one, but you need to talk to your soundguy and find out if that approach is genuinely doable. So that depends on the size of the PA and the number of monitor feeds available and already in use. Chances are if you have monitors that reproduce bass well and the option of your own feed then you'll be able to go down that route.

If not, my general rule of thumb for a bass amp for live is to start at 300w for a solid state rig. You may be able to get away with less due to the music you play but you won't really know until you use the amp with the band. See if you can try whatever rig you end up looking at buying at a practice.

One final piece of advice: amps are important. An average/slightly crappy bass into a great amp will sound great, provided the player is ok and the bass is playable. A great bass into an average/slightly crappy bass amp will sound bad regardless of who is playing it. When it comes to electric instruments amplification is always the key part of the signal chain.

[TmcB]

One final piece of advice: amps are important. An average/slightly crappy bass into a great amp will sound great, provided the player is ok and the bass is playable. A great bass into an average/slightly crappy bass amp will sound bad regardless of who is playing it. When it comes to electric instruments amplification is always the key part of the signal chain.

I'd normally agree completely here but considering that most of the time the sound guy DI's you straight into the desk with bass, I feel it's better to start out with the best sounding bass you can get then move onto a good sounding amp to complete the setup. You'll have more immediate flexibility if you've got a bass that sounds great when chucked naked through the system (without eq).

[Pakehendrix]

Definitely go second hand with your first bass, and I would lean towards either the Tech 21 VT bass or a good second-hand amp if you can as well. I'd probably lean more towards Hot Grits' advice re: amp, but different strokes/ymmv etc...

[Hot_Grits]

One final piece of advice: amps are important. An average/slightly crappy bass into a great amp will sound great, provided the player is ok and the bass is playable. A great bass into an average/slightly crappy bass amp will sound bad regardless of who is playing it. When it comes to electric instruments amplification is always the key part of the signal chain.

I'd normally agree completely here but considering that most of the time the sound guy DI's you straight into the desk with bass, I feel it's better to start out with the best sounding bass you can get then move onto a good sounding amp to complete the setup. You'll have more immediate flexibility if you've got a bass that sounds great when chucked naked through the system (without eq).

We absolutely agree, but this is dependent on the live situation at hand. Hence the ask the soundguy bit. No use going direct if you can't get it in the monitors.

[sonicfantom]

According to the techie, I will be DI'd straight into the PA. Not sure how the elec is going to be making sound, but that's the way he's going with my output (he'll probably stick an amp in the room for the elec).

This means that I don't need to worry about amps for when I perform, and I can get away with one of those mini amps with headphone jacks for practice at home (seeing as nobody else seems to appreciate my playing after about 10 PM or so, which is when most of my jamming gets done).

Anyway, here's the next problem: I'm assuming that I need a bass driver (with preamp, eq, and DI all in one) eventually. At the moment, the techie has plain old DI boxes - the electronic drum kit is plugged into one of these as well - will this do the job with my bass? They do the job well with the acoustic/electric that I play at the moment, but that's got a preamp powered by a 9V battery - whereas the Jazz Bass is passive, and will need a preamp?

Going straight from acoustic to bass, so I don't have much experience with the electronic side of things.

Other than that, i've been looking for either a Squier Standard Jazz Bass or a used Fender Jazz Bass. Plenty of brand new Squiers at therockshop - including the exact one that I want to buy, in 3-color Antique Burst - but there's nothing I can afford in terms of used Fender Jazz basses.

Not very fond of the Precision's tone, and most other basses make me feel like I'm holding a cricket bat by the thick end.

Long, long post

[Pakehendrix]

Long, long post

you haven't seen a proper rant then...

[Timi]

As BG implied, don't spend $700 on a new squire, spend that on a used Mexican Fender Jazz which is generally a cut above but there's a fella on here with some serious gear that loves his squire.

Probably me. It took me a long time to find a Fender better than that Squire but I finally found one in Auckland a few months back. Ended up with an MIM actually, they had a few MIAs next to it which weren't as nice.

My advice with the bass is to go and play one that feels right with no regard of the brand on the headstock. Don't bother changing pickups (even on a Squire) unless you want a drastically different tone.

A VT Bass into DI would get you there, but having no amp means more pressure on the monitors. If you aren't super loud and you have a good monitoring system you will be ok, if you are loud with average monitors you will want all the headroom you can get for vocals. If that is the case try and find an old Peavey bass combo if you have no budget.

Personally I would avoid the Sansamp Bass Driver because they sound awful. The VT Bass is much better but can still be a little bit hyped, just warning you.

[alanp]

Picked up a $400 Squier new from the Rock Shop, Vince didn't seem too horrified by it at the last Wellyfest.

[foal30]

yup it's amazing what $400 gets you now
miles better than the tat we had to put up with
BACK IN THE DAY

[sonicfantom]

My advice with the bass is to go and play one that feels right with no regard of the brand on the headstock. Don't bother changing pickups (even on a Squire) unless you want a drastically different tone.

That's what I did, weaving my way past the expensive basses, and I ended up with the Squier. I just love the neck, it's amazing - though it probably needs a trip to a technician to get the action sorted. The one I played was a bit high, though maybe it was just that specific bass).

I have plenty of time to decide (playing a backup-to-the-backup-bass borrowed from a friend), so I might put it off until the family goes to holiday in Korea...? Stuff's cheaper over there, but I trust the local Rockshop, and I'll need a flight case to bring the bass back (More $$$).

Thanks for the advice on pickups! I was just wondering about it, since my friend (same one that lent me that bass) changed the pickups on her P-bass, and it sounds a WHOLE lot better. Come to think of it, it was probably because of the crappy condition of the pickups it had on it when she bought it.

Amplification problems fixed, it's not my business, apparently. It's coming out of the sound guy's budget, so let's forget about that. Actually, while I'm at it - any suggestions for a practice amp? I'll have headphones plugged in about 75% of the time, so that's gonna influence my choice a whole heap.

Probably me. It took me a long time to find a Fender better than that Squire but I finally found one in Auckland a few months back. Ended up with an MIM actually, they had a few MIAs next to it which weren't as nice.

What's the difference? I know that the MIAs have "higher" QC (mostly around the frets, it seems), and come with an inflated market price.

Modifying stuff never makes it worth more, but you feel it should.

I'd skimp on the amp and put funds towards a bass too.

And +1 to not playing it like a frustrated guitarist

I don't plan to sell it (and seeing as I can't imagine parting with the guitar I have now, i'm pretty sure I won't). I get attached to stuff I touch and tinker with.

Agree to the amp thing. You don't carry an amp around, but you sure as hell take the bass with you.

How do you play a bass like a frustrated guitarist? Never met one before, so I'm not sure. Come to think of it, there aren't many bassists out there when I think about it.

Thanks heaps for the help, everyone!

[RUDENBARK]

Amplification problems fixed, it's not my business, apparently. It's coming out of the sound guy's budget, so let's forget about that. Actually, while I'm at it - any suggestions for a practice amp? I'll have headphones plugged in about 75% of the time, so that's gonna influence my choice a whole heap.

If it's just for headphone practice, POD might be the way to go? Ie:

http://www.rockshop.co.nz/04/shop/produ ... CKETPODEXP
http://www.rockshop.co.nz/04/shop/produ ... IPOCKETPOD

Aimed more at the gatman (dunno what these models are like for bass). But more versatile than a prac amp, esp if only (or mostly) using headphones. Portible too, prac anywhere. (Even on the bus - "Dare! Dare! Dare!.....")
Not much good for live playing (as in generally "not recommended"), but can plug into the mixer(amp) if need be.