NZGuitars.com

If we take this guitar as an example, how much would you look to sell this for? Mainly out of curiosity but...

Yes please, I love your design aesthetic Lawrence!!!

Mini Forklift Ⓥ wrote:If we take this guitar as an example, how much would you look to sell this for? Mainly out of curiosity but...

really hard question. The cost of materials is the starting point, and from there you have to think about what to charge for time, knowledge, mojo etc.

Ash sold the Radians for about $1K - $1500...but didnt have to make the necks - and the customs for over double that. he was also more experienced than I...

Let me ponder and Ill take this further tomorrow...

so I have some questions - please help....but first.

The bottom line for hardware costs seems to be about $420..thats for 2 pickups, tuners, bridge, nut, pots, knobs, wire, caps, switch, dots, truss rod, Fretwire and strap buttons. (since I am paying retail I am NOT adding a markup to any of the costs)

The bottom line for wood is harder to define, but assuming an imported fretboard ($70) and a locally sourced body and neck...lets say $100 tho you might get lucky..

this will need at least 2-3 lots of freight (one international) so $100

Then consumables..adhesive, abrasives, oil, shielding, power, vacuum bags..coffee ...$100


So all up costs at least $800 for a cheap instrument. So what about labour etc...

These are optimistic estimates assuming everything goes well....(if some of you can do these things faster then good luck to you)
Wood prep and glue up - 3 Hours
cutting, routing - 3 hours
Shaping 3 hours
Sanding - 3 hours
Fretboard and neck glue up - 2 Hours
Fretting 2 Hours
Final Sanding 3 hours
Oiling - 5 hours over 2 weeks...
Mounting hardware - 2 Hours
Fret Dress - 2 Hours
Wiring - 1 Hour
setup - 1 hour

27 hours..(NEVER have I managed to do this even close to this fast!
So, lets say 30 hours at say $25.00 an hour...seems reasonable for skilled labour... = $750

what about design, planning, spousal abuse, cat frightening, cleaning, sharpening......and profit.
Im going to add a very well earned $250.

So it seems to me that $1800 is as cheap as a one off, hand made guitar can be . That buys you a pretty flash instrument off the shelf from a store...

Questions:
Would anyone consider this an acceptable price for a first sale by an unknown almost luthier (no commitments).
Should I add a case and the cost that goes with that?
Should I go for better quality hardware and pickups - probably adding $300 or more to the cost?
What sort of warranty would be expected?
(Note: I have yet to need to adjust the trussrod on any of my guitars...but they do live in a relatively dry and temperature controlled house. Ive never had a joint come apart....touch wood)

I think thats incredibly cheap for a custom guitar, but on the other side, it puts it within reach of far more people like myself... hmmmm....

On other thing that seems to get mentioned with custom builds is resale value. So at what price point would someone buy something from you if they have resale in the back of their mind.

Lawrence wrote:so I have some questions - please help....but first.

The bottom line for hardware costs seems to be about $420..thats for 2 pickups, tuners, bridge, nut, pots, knobs, wire, caps, switch, dots, truss rod, Fretwire and strap buttons. (since I am paying retail I am NOT adding a markup to any of the costs)

The bottom line for wood is harder to define, but assuming an imported fretboard ($70) and a locally sourced body and neck...lets say $100 tho you might get lucky..

this will need at least 2-3 lots of freight (one international) so $100

Then consumables..adhesive, abrasives, oil, shielding, power, vacuum bags..coffee ...$100


So all up costs at least $800 for a cheap instrument. So what about labour etc...

These are optimistic estimates assuming everything goes well....(if some of you can do these things faster then good luck to you)
Wood prep and glue up - 3 Hours
cutting, routing - 3 hours
Shaping 3 hours
Sanding - 3 hours
Fretboard and neck glue up - 2 Hours
Fretting 2 Hours
Final Sanding 3 hours
Oiling - 5 hours over 2 weeks...
Mounting hardware - 2 Hours
Fret Dress - 2 Hours
Wiring - 1 Hour
setup - 1 hour

27 hours..(NEVER have I managed to do this even close to this fast!
So, lets say 30 hours at say $25.00 an hour...seems reasonable for skilled labour... = $750

what about design, planning, spousal abuse, cat frightening, cleaning, sharpening......and profit.
Im going to add a very well earned $250.

So it seems to me that $1800 is as cheap as a one off, hand made guitar can be . That buys you a pretty flash instrument off the shelf from a store...

Questions:
Would anyone consider this an acceptable price for a first sale by an unknown almost luthier (no commitments).
Should I add a case and the cost that goes with that?
Should I go for better quality hardware and pickups - probably adding $300 or more to the cost?
What sort of warranty would be expected?
(Note: I have yet to need to adjust the trussrod on any of my guitars...but they do live in a relatively dry and temperature controlled house. Ive never had a joint come apart....touch wood)

I think you are selling yourself short... Your hours are way too optimistic. Perhaps if you already have created all templates and you making the same model over and over again, then you may be able to reduce build hours but still not down to 30!

Making the templates and tools for the archtop I am building easily took over 20 hours by itself. Okay, you should not count that for a one off, but it still needs to be spread out over the number you intend to make.

Re the timber, I don't buy that, I mill it myself, so chainsawing, chopping tree costs, then planing the wood, cutting it in planks, etc. All labour but I don't take it into account as I enjoy preparing all the 'raw' materials. I tend to put that 'saving' into better hardware.

Building the neck I find very time consuming, partially because of limited tools available and partially because it is such a critical part of the guitar. Shaping, sanding, gluing, cutting nut, cutting inlays, radiusing fretboard, fretting, logo, etc. There goes 20 odd hours for me I'd say.

Bodyshape will determine hours as a simple Tele body is much easier than arched top, access covers or putting the pots in through the F hole.

In short, Adrian did not do necks and he quit because he could not make a decent living out of it.

If I needed to sell a home made guitar it would have to be for about $2K and I would need to be desperate. Then again, for me it is a hobby, so some of the payback is to see something I created out of 'nothing' turn into some that is very functional and pleasing to my eyes and ears.

$1800 sounds like a bargain for a hand made in NZ custom guitar.

Ash made 2 guitars for me, and I have a Radian. Both customs cost a chunk over 2k, and that was 10 and 5 years ago. So I wouldn't expect to get them as cheap if he was still building.

The Radian is good, but as far as necks go, I went in to get one of his Radians, played one of the Ash customs, and walked out having paid a deposit on my Aurum. The hand made neck is superb.

Also, if you're worried about resale, go buy a 2nd hand fender.

Couple of years later I spotted the Radian on tardme, so I scored that too.

jvpp wrote:
I think you are selling yourself short... Your hours are way too optimistic

but i'm picking he doesn't saw his wood with a handsaw like you thats like 3 weeks work just there

jvpp wrote: I think you are selling yourself short... Your hours are way too optimistic.
.

Yes the reality is more hours but its a question of the market value. I never got into this to sell guitars...actually I got into it cos getting a guitar made cost to much.
The challenge with keeping going now is the cost of doing it...and living in a room full of guitars. Ive had many people say I should sell and so Im trying this out.

Keep the feedback coming its useful.

willow13 wrote:

jvpp wrote:
I think you are selling yourself short... Your hours are way too optimistic

but i'm picking he doesn't saw his wood with a handsaw like you thats like 3 weeks work just there

Ha, you are right there. Crazy. Some people go on a threadmill, I'll go on my sawmill. I haven't done that again...

jvpp wrote:

willow13 wrote:

jvpp wrote:
I think you are selling yourself short... Your hours are way too optimistic

but i'm picking he doesn't saw his wood with a handsaw like you thats like 3 weeks work just there

Ha, you are right there. Crazy. Some people go on a threadmill, I'll go on my sawmill. I haven't done that again...

I have 15 alder logs that need sawing

willow13 wrote:

jvpp wrote:

willow13 wrote:
but i'm picking he doesn't saw his wood with a handsaw like you thats like 3 weeks work just there

Ha, you are right there. Crazy. Some people go on a threadmill, I'll go on my sawmill. I haven't done that again...

I have 15 alder logs that need sawing

Can help in return for a bitof timber

jvpp wrote:

willow13 wrote:

jvpp wrote:

Ha, you are right there. Crazy. Some people go on a threadmill, I'll go on my sawmill. I haven't done that again...

I have 15 alder logs that need sawing

Can help in return for a bitof timber

awesome, but I will probably take them to a small saw mill when the time comes as I have a few other logs that need sawing as well.....can sort you with some timber once they are done. Mind you they have only been drying for 3 weeks so it will be a while away

Drying time is something like 1 inch per year or something isn't it??