Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

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cholera
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Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by cholera »

Doing some recording in central Hutt over the weekend and looking to see if anyone has a snake they can lend so we can get a bit further away from the amps. Going to be doing a little experimenting with room micing for the guitars.

For the record, I'll be plugging my Universe into a JCM 800KK through a Marshall cab, a 5150 through a Recto a cab, and a Triaxis/VHT 2 90 2 through another Recto cab and a no name cab with Celestion GT 75's.
Planning on making it fairly loud, and as an aside as we will use on mic per pair of cabs, the mics will be a little further from the speakers than I have normally had before, in order to try get a mix from both cabs....can anyone offer any advice on this? My main concern is that too much distance away from the speaker may result in loss of attack? Going for the heaviest sound possible, but it's also fast so at least a semblance of definition is required.Its an interesting set up to say the least with certain effects going to some amps and keeping a dry signal on others, it sounds absolutely killer in the rom....but...transcribing that to a recording is always tough.

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by rickenbackerkid »

if you want tight and defined, then you want to close mic.

This carry on out about mic'ing a few feet back to pick up multiple speakers/cabs is fraught with difficulties!

I would personally close mic each cab separately, AND have a room mic as well. That way you can treat the close mics as needed for the definition and tone you need, and add some room mic if needed.

It might be interesting to vary your close mics, maybe a 57 on one amp, an SDC on one and a ribbon on one. That gives you even more options.

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by cholera »

Thanks Ben, thats kinda what I thought RE close micing....the guy recording us (hes really doing it for himself, and using us as guinea pigs) wants to capture the cab sound as opposed to just the amp sound and thnks we can make up for the distance from the speaker with lots and lots of volume. Curious to see how it turns out. Id love to try different mics on each cab but we are working with a pretty small pallete, I think its sm57s all the way, not that I paid much attention to to that side of things.....

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by godgrinder »

You probably want to make sure that they are all in phase first. Do you have an AB box with phase flip on it?

For this kind of situation I would rather just record with 1 amp first and keep a clean DI track at the same time, then reamp using the other 2. More control and less potential phase mess.
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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by cholera »

Got a radial Big shot Fei, but the 5150/800 is on one side of that, and split with a stereo pedal....so, its the height of sophistication. Amazingly enough there doesn't seem to be any noise issues with the 3 heads going at once, and I'm guessing phase issues don't become apparent until they are actually recorded?
Anyway, the point of the exercise is not for us to have a rad recording its for Matt to be able to experiment a bit, as hes new to the whole thing. Unfortunately the end result is what is going to be sent to Exordium Mark for the Axiom zine so hopefully its not a total disaster. Going by the tightness of the drum tracks tho, I'd say we are well on the way to it being that way!

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Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by Eruera »

I have a snake you could borrow but I guess I'm a bit far away

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by jeremyb »

Eruera wrote:I have a snake you could borrow but I guess I'm a bit far away
Your pants aren't THAT far away!
Slowy wrote: That's the problem; everything rewarding is just such hard work. Regret takes much less effort.

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by godgrinder »

That reminded me when Boris had custom 3-way splitters made so they can make sure everything's in phase when using 3 amps together hahaha...

You are probably picking up more room reflections than "cab sound" with distant micing. But if the room sounds nice you would get a good sounding natural reverb.

Even with close micing 1 speaker in a cab, you are still picking up some basic cab characteristics, how the sound reflects inside the cab and how the speakers reinforce/cancel frequencies with each other. Otherwise all cabs with same speakers would pretty much record the same, while that's not the case.

I would really recommend at least close micing one of the cabs and keep a clean DI track. So even if the experimentation goes wrong you would still have something to fall back on for that zine inclusion.
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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by cholera »

Ok Fei...I'm actually trying to convince him that we need to do that....I figure there is a reason everyone else does it. Room reflection is sometrhing hes looking to get because everything does sound pretty sweet in the room.
Eruera, thanks for the offer, Id ask how long yr snake is but it's way too easy.

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by rickenbackerkid »

cholera wrote:the guy recording us (hes really doing it for himself, and using us as guinea pigs) wants to capture the cab sound as opposed to just the amp sound and thnks we can make up for the distance from the speaker with lots and lots of volume. Curious to see how it turns out.
He may be on to something... it could be awesome. But then again it may not be. I think that approach/vibe might work really well for bluesy/classic rock stuff, not sure about heavy music . . . . .

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by cholera »

Oh well only one way to find out I guess...there are lots of "doomy" bits, and I think it could work well for that kinda stuff, but it's the super fast riffs over balst beats that need to be tight that I'm worried about.

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by godgrinder »

The Mosquito Control CD was done live in a nice sounding big hall. We used a ceiling room mic which provided very nice verbs. However there were a lot of close miced speaker (and even cab-sim line out) in the mix too.
Amps:
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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by SimonHirst »

If you're wanting to experiment it would be ideal to do both with close mixing and mics further away. That way you've got something to fall back on if you don't like one of them. It also gives you the ability, if you like both sounds, to blend them. I always mic up amps using two different mics if possible. If you manage to get a good complementing pair it can produce a really great sound, and being able to blend them differently, depending on what sound you're after, can be very useful.

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Re: Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by cholera »

Thanks for the input guys. All good to know for next time.

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Need a snake-Lower Hutt/Wellington.

Post by Gonzbull »

I'd tend to use a ribbon or condenser for distance mics . A trick I use is to walk around the space while the rig is being played and stick a mic where you like the sound best. Audio hire companies are a good source for snakes and mics too for loan. Oceania here in AK has a great selection of mics for hire.

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