I suck at guitar

Its all in the fingers, or is it?

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Vince
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by Vince »

Slowy wrote: The real trap is that most of us compare ourselves to other players, and no matter what we learn, we will always compare ourselves to someone better.
Which in itself is fucking weird. I mean, I can't think of any other activity where people get all down because they're not (spontaneously) as good as world-famous professionals. I loved motorbikes but I was never downhearted because I couldn't corner like Valentino Rossi. In fact, I knew better than to even try. :lol: And lots of people get out and play team sports and have a great time even though they KNOW they will never be like Messi or Messam (I always get them confused)
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by Slowy »

Vince wrote:
Slowy wrote: The real trap is that most of us compare ourselves to other players, and no matter what we learn, we will always compare ourselves to someone better.
Which in itself is fucking weird. I mean, I can't think of any other activity where people get all down because they're not (spontaneously) as good as world-famous professionals. I loved motorbikes but I was never downhearted because I couldn't corner like Valentino Rossi. In fact, I knew better than to even try. :lol: And lots of people get out and play team sports and have a great time even though they KNOW they will never be like Messi or Messam (I always get them confused)
I ride with a couple of Mountainbike champions. In my reflective moments, lying in hospital beds, I remind myself I really shouldn't be trying to keep up with them and actually, I'm better at guitar and probably should consider, for the sake of my health, spending much more time playing. :rofl:
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by sizzlingbadger »

Molly wrote:I'm a very visual learner so do picture shapes and step patterns when finding my way around the guitar. For nobody in particular, this is how I see it. For me it starts from two step patterns:

Major: T T st T T T st
Minor: T st T T st T T

I know that for every major key there is a relative natural minor. Looking at a piano keyboard and playing the white keys from C to C is the CMaj scale (the first step pattern above). Playing the same notes but starting and finishing on A is the above minor step pattern and the notes from a natural Amin scale. Little changes like sharpening the 7th step of that scale give the harmonic minor scale and sharpening the 6th step too gives the melodic minor. Just slightly different flavours.

Pentatonic are a simpler route through the octave. Not a 'scenic' a route around the fretboard maybe but they're worth knowing.

As for the modes. They're variations on the above step patterns whereby the first interval is moved to the end of the sequence. I don't use them often at all to be honest but, for example, can apply the Mixolydian by looking at it like this. I know it's a major mode (has a major third interval between the root and third notes - four frets if you like). If the song is in A Maj and I want to use the Mixolydian mode I know that by playing in Bm but from A to A rather than B to B I will have the correct step pattern for that mode. I just memorise a few of these 'rules' and it allows me to shift my usual playing in a given key to the correct position to apply the step pattern of the mode I want. I'm effectively just playing out of key.

Haven't the slightest idea if any of that is of any use to anybody or if it's just confused matters. I'm so locked in my way of doing things it's hard to know if it makes sense or not.

The following is a resource I use with students to help them open up the whole neck when learning to solo. I usually have them confine their playing to a few notes or solos quickly come to sound like scale recital. 'Working' a couple of notes from within any of the following helps them develop technique. Coloured dots are pentatonic. The additional dots make those scales diatonic (like the step patterns at the start of this drivel).

[url=http://s1370.photobucket.com/user/balla ... p.jpg.html]
Unfortunately this is exactly the sort of thing that confuses me, it has no explanation as to why some of the terms even mean. I think one of the problems absolute beginners have is being taught by people that forget they already know so much. Its like someone is trying to explain something to you but they forget they are speaking in a different language.

Step patterns ? is this scales you are talking about ? looks like major and minor scale formula's to me. I find it easier to remember these by breaking them into 2 sets of 3...

Major = WWH W WWH whole tones and half tones joined by a whole tone.

Pentatonic is a 5 note scale, there lots of these. Diatonic ? not sure about that one.

Mixolydian mode ? I know a bit about modes, Rob Chapman has a great youtube video that explains them better than anywhere else if looked so far. I'm just not sure why you would pick one mode over another, feel of the song is my guess.

What are the different colour icons on the neck ? what are the smily faces ? what are the big dotted brackets for ? It says it shows positions for 2 keys but there three neck diagrams ?

You see when your a beginner it very easy to look at that and think WTF ?

Not a dig at you personally Molly I'm sure this was targeted at people with more musical knowledge than me but I just wanted to show the sort of thing I feel I'm up against :winky:
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by Molly »

sizzlingbadger wrote:
Not a dig at you personally Molly I'm sure this was targeted at people with more musical knowledge than me but I just wanted to show the sort of thing I feel I'm up against :winky:
It's more that I was trying to cram it into a forum post. I'd be able to explain it so much better in person, of course.

Will clarify a bit later.

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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by Molly »

Last edited by Molly on Wed Jul 13, 2016 1:03 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by sizzlingbadger »

Thanks for the follow up Molly.
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by sizzlingbadger »

jeremyb wrote:The most enjoyable thing I've ever "past participle of get" out of the instrument is from playing with other people, yes it's daunting!!!! but way more fun, even if you're a beginner there are things to be gained (timing, improving your ear etc..)

Do you know anyone who plays drums or bass you could jam with? even just basic stuff, banging out some simple 3 chord songs can make your enjoyment and therefore motivation improve :)

Also read this book: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0085 ... k_ro_title I wish I'd read this 25 years ago when I first picked up a guitar, I'm still stuck in intermediate level player hell :lol:
I bought the book at the weekend and its excellent, I'm basically doing all the things it says not to do :lol:
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by calling card »

Everything is fine until some kid born long after you hands your sonic arse to you on a plate. Keep going.... :)
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by vintage52 »

I have sucked at guitar for over 20 years.

Best thing that happened to me was being pulled into a church band where combined there were over 8 different flavours and styles brought into the mix.

From the real happy clappy dude to Hank Williams and AC/DC tones.

What I found was I was pulled with the band in all directions and it meant two things for me:

A focus on practice - had to get the songs to a level where we may have sounded like arse, but it was pretty arse.

I had the guitar in my hands a lot more. The more I hang onto and play it, the more I get to understand.
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by MattH »

calling card wrote:Everything is fine until some kid born long after you hands your sonic arse to you on a plate.
Like this little ginger tosser...

http://www.roryevansguitar.co.uk/

There's a link on his Facebook where he's learning sax solos from James Brown records and just nailing it...

I hate him.
All the gear... absolutely no idea...

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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by shafter »

Because I'm one of the many who think I suck... I have looked around to find something to help me with my playing, ive been playing for 20 years and have not really become the guitarist i wanted to be.. but not long ago I found a guy on the net which at least for me made a lot of sense!! His name is David Walliman, some of you may have heard of him. He teaches many levels and is very clear and practical, check out his youtube channel.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Wallimann
He also has a website https://www.guitarplayback.com/
This is a real treasure and something thats been helping me a lot especially with improvising (my biggest weakness)
Unfortunately the lessons do cost but I do have some of them if anyones interested heres a list
Melodic Sequences
Tasty Practical Licks
Soulful Jam Tracks
Chord Scales
High Voltage Jam Tracks
Modal Explorer
Applied Theory
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by jimi »

Not the first to say this in this thread, but going to say it again anyway...

Find some mates into the same sort of music and get together for a jam. Playing with other people will expose you to new ideas and put some context to the theory you already have.

I suck pretty bad, but jamming with guys here took me from playing nirvana covers with 2 finger 5th chords to being able to fit in at a jam and throw in a dodgy blues solo here and there.

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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by calling card »

Part of me wishes I'd stayed with those 2 finger power chords and happily punked into oblivion.
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by sizzlingbadger »

Was looking at modes on you-tube and found this explanation - might as well be in Russian lol !

E Mixolydian is a scale in E and is used over an E7 chord. The parent scale is A Major aka A Ionian. Say you are in the key of C and D Minor is played. Which mode do you play? Well because D is the second note of the C scale then you play D Dorian which is the second mode. If in C, and A Minor is played, then that is the 6th note and so you use the 6th mode which is Aolian. So 1 Major gets Ionian, 2 Minor gets Dorian, 3 Minor gets Phrygian, 4 Major gets Lydian, 5 Major gets Mixolydian, 6 Minor gets Aolian, and 7 Diminished gets Locrian. You choose the mode based on what number chord in the key it is. To be correct, you should write the chord degrees using Roman numerals; so not the "4 Chord" but the "IV chord". So Am-Dm-G7-C would be analyzed (Harmonic Analysis) as vi-ii-V-I and you'd play A Aolian/D Dorian/G Mixolydian/C Ionian. 1-4-5 get capitalized letters, and 2-3-6-7 get lower case letters. It's important to know the "parent scale" but don't think that way when playing the scale.

Mixolydian = a disease that rabbits get
Aolian = a garlic salad dressing
Dorian = some guy that never aged
Phrygian = A girl that always says no
Locrian = One of the alien captains from Star Trek
Lydian = not sure about that one...
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Re: I suck at guitar

Post by Scooter13 »

If you ever feel like you've "past participle of get" no where, try flipping the guitar over and playing with your other hands (like a lefty if you're a righty). Then remember that's how it felt when u started.

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